seeing_ghosts: (Dean/Cas [4x07])
[personal profile] seeing_ghosts

Before we get to the episode itself, have a snippet of a conversation I want to see happen on the show: 



Dean flips through the contents of his cellphone, his shiniest new toy. Cas, sitting next to him in the diner booth, shifts suddenly and says, "Dean, you write my name incorrectly." 

Dean, without turning, replies, "What?" 

"My name," Castiel continues. "You have my cellular phone number saved under the name 'Cass,' with double S. That is incorrect." 

At this, Dean turns his head to look at Cas. "Come again?" 

Castiel, face blank and voice patient as if talking to a child, says, "My name is Castiel. There are no doubled letters, Dean. You should change it." 

Dean opens and closes his mouth, at loss for words, before turning back to his phone. "No." 

"Excuse me?" 

Dean sighs, fighting the urge to roll his eyes or maybe slap Cas upside the head. "Look, buddy - I gave you that nickname, I get to decide how to write it. Capiche?" 

"But - " Cas starts before Dean cuts him off. 

"No buts, Cas." 
______________________________
* Cas = the fandom; Dean = the writers.




Anyway, as for the episode - usual warnings still apply (spoilers, speculation... Shipping...) 


I read, not too long ago, a post on tumblr where someone compared the producers and writers (I wanted to write the showrunners, but I'm pretty sure that's not what it's called in Britain) of Doctor Who, Russel T Davies and Steven Moffat. Basically, what the OP on tumblr said is that they dislike the way Moffat has been handling the show, because his writing got a bit messy - he kept hyping up random things for prolonged periods of time, and then left the viewers hanging without any real, mind-blowing resolve; whereas Davies kept subtly writing in clues, like leaving the words BAD WOLF all over the place, but without showing them down the viewers' throats and then let them come together in one, big reveal. 

Now, I am not a regular watcher of DW so I wouldn't know how true that is, and I don't want to compare the current and past showrunners of SPN, but my point is - that's kind of what I've been feeling about Supernatural lately. And I've been willing to let it slide for a while, let the writers sort their shit out - but the thing is, it's been 7 episodes and we only now found out what happened in Purgatory, and wow, what a shocker - Castiel let go of Dean's hand himself! Wow, what a twist. 

Let's not point out the fact that Dean's headspace by now is a complete mess - when he got out he explicitly said that it was Cas who let go; by the next episode, he somehow managed to convince himself that it was, in fact, him. And now, Castiel comes back and tells Dean that no, he remembers it all wrong! 

I am fairly certain that the angels are to blame for this; in the first episode Dean seems to know which way is up - then, an episode later, he meets Alfie the friendly neighbour angel and suddenly, his memories change. If the angels don't have their fingers in this I am going to be very disappointed. As much as I like the idea of Dean coping so badly he would rather believe that he failed Cas than that Cas chose not to go with him (be still my heart!), I don't think Dean is quite that far off yet. 

And don't get me started on Sam's storyline that, so far, makes as little sense as all the others. 

I just feel like the writers are toying with us, creating suspense at the expense of common sense but mostly, I just feel lied to. I want to know what the characters know, not to be lead along for quarter of the season, dammit!

On the other hand, the "Crowley vs. the Prophet of the Lord vs. Closing the Gates of Hell forever" storyline seems amazing. Kevin is perfect this season, believable and human and fresh where all the other characters are so world-weary. Crowley is, as per usual, vicious and I'm glad we're getting to see that side of him more clearly.

I won't go much into the whole Dean/Cas mess - let me just say that THEY ARE SO IN LOVE I love it. I want more of Cas comforting Dean. A lot more of it. But I wish that the show answered some of the long-standing questions first. 


Date: 2012-11-15 03:48 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparrow-lately.livejournal.com
LOL at the Cas/Cass debate. I really want to see Sam being super earnest like, "Dean there's only one S in Castiel."

Onto bigger things...this season's got a bit of an ADD problem that reminds me of waaaaaay back in the day when I used to watch House (and I mean old-schoool House, too). That show had a bad habit where they'd introduce a fascinating bit of backstory for Chase, or else have him do something really interesting, and then proceed to completely ignore it in favor of focusing on how Foreman Is the New House and Cameron Is Having an Emotion. I remember being really frustrated--if they wanted to focus on Foreman and Cameron, give them the fascinating plot lines! If they wanted to give Chase fascinating plot lines, give Chase some screen time!

Which I think is actually the same root problem with this season of SPN so far. They have a lot of interesting things going on, but they'll introduce them and then bounce away and focus on something else. Look, I love the Winchesters and their abandonment/entitlement/general issues as much as anybody, but we have seen these arguments before. We haven't seen Benny before. We haven't seen Dean angsting over being unable to same someone who was actually more in control than he was the whole time before. Barring Jess, who never got more than a whiff of characterization, we've never seen Sam in a relationship that wasn't fueled by crazy before (oh hey Ruby). We've never seen the Winchesters forced to work with other hunters and outsiders like Garth and the Trans in the long term before (I don't count the Roadhouse gang because, well, they didn't actually work with them all that often and when they did they had a tendency to duck out as soon as humanly possible afterwards; Bobby was, I think, family first and a hunter second). And no matter what we've already seen Cas(s) doing, there's a way to make it interesting, because he is a total gem of a character, so.

I see your point re: angels fucking with Dean's memory of things, but I really, really like the idea that Dean just completely rejected the idea that Cas threw him off. It fits with Dean's highly developed guilt complex, and it plays into the idea that Dean's brain is well and truly fried this time, which is an idea this season has been more willing to play with than any before (constant flashbacks, anybody? or how about the general acceptance level when he thought he realized he was hallucinating his dead best friend?). But they might just let this one go after this episode which would be annoying.

HOLY MOTHER OF GOD THIS COMMENT GOT LONG but suffice to say I will be laughing forever at how much Sam treats Dean and Cas like a couple.

Date: 2012-11-15 05:00 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] seeing-ghosts.livejournal.com
They should totally address the Cas/Cass issue, because it is an important issue.

EVERYTHING YOU SAY IS GOLDEN. No, really, I have nothing to add. I wish we had new episode EVERYDAY because I love reading your reactions to my reactions - probably more than the episodes! ;D

As for Alfie mindfucking Dean vs. Dean going off the rails - I like the latter idea, too, I really do. But if that's what they're going for then I don't think they have handled it well. It seems chunky and confused (not in a good way) and messy, and it's really really unclear what's actually going on (AND I HATE THAT, IN CASE YOU HAVEN'T NOTICED!). I was thinking about it, too; about Dean being so screwed in the head, finally, that he actually snapped - because making up memories just so that you can deal with going on from day to day? That is heavy, even for Dean. But the more I thought about it, the more it seemed like serious characterization acrobatics, and the angels altering his memory somehow seems much more plausible to me at the moment.

But imagine it - Dean making up a false memory of "failing Cas" because it's easier to deal with than with the idea of Cas willingly 'leaving' him? Oh, God. This ship is pain! And Dean's so upset, too, and so scared that Cas will hate him and defensive from the very beginning, and convincing everyone, including himself, that he wouldn't have left Cas behind, that he couldn't. And Cas is so shocked that Dean would even think that, and I love how neither of them realize how their actions affect the other ("And if you [died]?" - "Then it would have been my problem." - "That's not the way I see it!") - they both think they are worth so little but mean so much to each other.

Dammit, I can't deal with all these feels.

I will be laughing forever at how much Sam treats Dean and Cas like a couple.

I keep saying it, Sam is the biggest shipper of us all! XD In the scene when Cas comes out of the bathroom and he's clean and shaven and looks like the old Cas again, and just stands there with his arms stretched out, waiting for approval; Dean just stares at him like he's the most beautiful thing he's ever seen (and shifts in his chair like he has a boner, LOL) and Sam just looks from one to the other, with that face of his that says, You guys are so cute.

... I'm sorry for barfing my feelings all over you.

Date: 2012-11-15 05:22 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparrow-lately.livejournal.com
I'm sitting here in a lecture on the Bauhaus (bored out of my mind, history geek though I am), red as a tomato. You're too kind!

I have to agree that I don't think SPN really has the skill to pull off a main character who has started creating self-damning memories rather than confront the reality of his abandonment issues. Speaking of House, they tried something to that effect. It's tricky, and after the initial shock wears off it's quick to fizzle out (or, worse, come crashing down round the ears). God knows their take on severe trauma with Sam was a bit of a mess. We shall see.

You gave me Dean/Cas feels. Seriously, those two love each other to pieces, and they see the good in be another in a way no one else does--Cas sees Dean's fundamental goodness and wants to protect it (and here I am compelled to point out that Dean is a protector who has very, very rarely been protected), and Dean just sees something strange and lost and brave in Cas and loves him so totally--Dean's love for Sam is unquestionable, but his love for Cas is so naked. He doesn't even really try to hide his fondness for Cas, even after that fondness has gotten him in serious hot water (that goes both ways, of course--Cas puts his ass on the line for Dean without complaint all the time).

OKAY EMOTIONS IN A LECTURE ON ARCHITECTURE NEW LOW, SPARROW.

Date: 2012-11-15 06:13 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] seeing-ghosts.livejournal.com
Aren't I always kind? ;DD No, but really. I'm just being honest.

They certainly don't have that, but I can't really say that I blame them or don't understand. It's complicated at best when you have a set storyline, let alone with one that's constantly shifting. That's why I wouldn't really want for them to go there explicitly, rather than just implying. Sam, poor little guy, is the proof of that. (That's also why I wouldn't want for Destiel to actually become canon, too. It's complicated at best, as well.)

I'm just going around the internet, spreading Dean/Cas feels today. And they do love each, and that's why I keep insisting they are so good for each other - because they do, despite everything, bring out the best in each other. And I cannot stress enough how much I love all the emotional honesty Dean has shown this season - he cannot hide anything from anyone and is just so open in (not only) his affections and it's so endearing to see. Also, JA is doing an amazing job (which, as much as I love the guy, I can't say about JP - and I absolutely adored how he played Sam in S7), so that adds a lot to it.

Not too long ago I started crying over a fanfic at work. I understand your turmoil.

Date: 2012-11-15 06:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparrow-lately.livejournal.com
Acceptable levels of "canon-ness" for me (because, fuck it, I guess I ship Dean/Cas now, but I humbly submit the show basically forced me into it): this thing they've got going on where Dean and Cas are expected to be loyal and close the way you'd expect a couple to be, possibly some very demonstrative moment or two wherein they state their feelings reasonably plainly (though it needn't be romantic per se so much as very, very devoted), maybe a gentle ratcheting up of the physicality (which is definitely already happening--they were basically an annoying couple on a hike in the purgatory flashbacks), and maybe the implication that once the series ends these two (assuming they are both alive) will stick together.

Beyond that, I agree. These are not the type of men to indulge in histrionics and grand romantic gestures, and I'll thank the show not to force them to. Not that I think they will. They've already pushed the envelope pretty far, and I'm fine with that.

In the meantime, emotions. Emotions everywhere, and I'm seriously typing this while some dick a dear friend is hollering at me to go into town with him, and in fairness, I do need to go to the pharmacy. I shall spend the entire walk drowning in feels. :P

Date: 2012-11-15 07:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] seeing-ghosts.livejournal.com
Yes, exactly! I'm happy with just the way things are between them - they are already so devoted to each other, and obviously care for each other so much, but I don't want them to get in a "relationship," simply because I don't think the show would know how to treat it and do it justice. And honestly, when has there ever been time for any kind of romance in SPN (not that either Dean or Cas are, or would be, particularly romantic)? All relationships presented have always been fucked (up) one way or another. I'd just leave it to the fans.

And besides, it's fun to pick the show apart for signs of D/C (although we don't have to do even that anymore, they're so obvious).

(Also, I feel like I've been forced into shipping it, too - not too long ago I shipped it for fun and then one day I rewatched S7 and BAM, I was done.)

Date: 2012-11-15 07:54 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparrow-lately.livejournal.com
I don't generally "ship" because I'm one of those people who's nine years old at heart and still goes "ewww! quit kissing and go fight monsters!"

But Dean and Cas's friendship gives me Emotions with a capital E and it's stopped feeling like an epic bromance and started feeling like love. They've crossed from Sirius and Lupin to Holmes and Watson in terms of devotion. That was the fangirliest thing I ever typed.

Date: 2012-11-15 08:14 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] seeing-ghosts.livejournal.com
Well, I know how that feels because I'm asexual and anything "friendlier" than a hug squicks me out a little. But as you said, there's bromance that's just fun to watch and then there's love in every sense of the word and yeah, Dean and Cas are there.

To be COMPLETELY honest with you, I want them to become canon just so that I can legit say that they are the most epic lovestory of all times.

... I think they are more, like, like Sam and Frodo, though. (I'm not really familiar with any Sherlock Holmes canon besides the movies with RDJ and BBC's Sherlock, to be honest. /is ashamed)

Date: 2012-11-15 08:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparrow-lately.livejournal.com
YOU JUST MADE A SAM AND FRODO COMPARISION OMFG

Ah, that's okay. I'm a big ol' Sherlock Holmes geek, and I love Holmes and Watson because they're both so very odd. Most adaptations play up Holmes's weirdness and make Watson the straight man, which is fair enough for broad strokes, but misses what makes them such a wonderful pair: they're both strange, lost souls--Watson every bit as much as Holmes--and they desperately need one another because they fill each other's weird, lost holes.

Which is why they're a lot like Cas and Dean. In fact...Cas the strange, intelligent oddball with minimal understanding of human interaction and a great and overwhelming love-bordering-on-fixation for one person, and Dean the lost soldier who plays the straight man but is just as weird in his own way and wouldn't have it any other way.

OH MY LORD, I need to reread some Holmes and have feelings.

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